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Riam Dean, 22, a native of the United Kingdom is suing apparel magnate Abercrombie and Fitch for discrimination, and, if the suit goes as planned, it appears she’ll win.
A&F, one of the leading chain retailers in the world, has a very clear-cut, cookie-cutter version of what they want their employees’ appearances to embody, and according to management, Dean did not look like “a girl from Abercrombie and Fitch,” as LFO once said so obnoxiously/poetically.
Riam Dean has a prosthetic arm that attaches at the elbow, and she typically wears a sweater to cover the prosthetic. While A&F employees are required to wear jeans and a polo shirt, she was given permission to wear a white cardigan while working on the floor. But only a few days after she started work, the store was paid a visit by the “visual team.” This group’s purpose is to sure the shop and its staff look up to code. One of the members of the team demanded she take off the cardigan, but she insisted she had permission to wear it. Nevertheless, she was asked by management to continue her employment in the stockroom, far out of the public eye. Management claimed that she “violated the ‘Look Policy,” which is an imperative part of working for such a prestigious clothing outlet. As if she could help the fact that she is, unfortunately, missing an arm. Totally her fault, I suppose. The nerve. Pssh.
Riam sucked it up and commenced her stockroom duties, normally reserved for the “underlings” (i.e., ethnic minorities) of Abercrombie & Fitch “society” and received a telephone call at home a few days later, asking if she would continue on board with the company’s stockroom until their winter uniforms came in, which consisted of long-sleeved tops. She quit on the spot.
Riam, who was born without a forearm, has utilized a prosthetic appendage for as long as she can remember. However, she never let her physical handicap become just that – a handicap. Dean is currently a student at Queen Mary University, located in London, and is pursuing a barrister’s degree.
A&F has never been a stranger to discrimination suits; one was recently settled in the US for discrimination during the hiring process in that they would allegedly only hire “young and beautiful” men and women to work in their stores.
I am not one of those sue-crazy citizens. I think that a lot of the lawsuits nowadays are setups. A lot of people abuse the legal system and look for loopholes to sue over practically everything. I have a family member quite like that and it drives me up the frigging wall. Yet, I hope Riam gets every penny. I hope she triple-sues. I hope after the suit goes through, she receives her requested money and additional funds for pain and suffering. The embarrassment at her treatment by A&F must be immense.
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I think private luxury goods vendors should be able to hire whomever they want. If you don’t like it, don’t patronize them.
JorgeMacD, your ignorance is appalling. What rock have you been under for the past 40 years?
MacD is entitled to his opinions, especially when it comes to free market enterprise. You, of course, can disagree, but do you really need to start off with an insult?
How about declaring your support for stronger equal opportunity employment laws? That keeps everything on the level and focused on the issue. Instead, the hostility of your statement makes it very easy to discredit or ignore.
i think private commenters can tell whoever they want to fuck off, especially when it comes to free market enterprise. if you don’t like it, don’t read their comment.
or does a+f get to be assholes in real life and i don’t get to be one on the internet?
What the devil are you talking about?
I would never shop at a&f but if she worked anyshere else I’d be just FINE with her as an employee as long as she wasn’t rude.
Well actually let me fill you in, the cardigan was not my idea in the first place, it was their idea. they told me to buy a white cardigan from any store as long as it fits the style of abercrombie. the cardigan was very short and my prosthetic arm was clear to everyone.
in their application form, it did not ask about disability(there was no disabled? then tick here box) so as soon as i got the job, i told them on my induction day.
i dont wear long sleaves in summer, its boiling hot, especially in that store. i was removed from the shop floor and then bullied and taunted by a manager who claimed she didnt know i had permission to wear the cardigan, but the incident happened in front of 4 of my managers and they let it happen.
the head manager wrote me an email and told me “oh yes i heard about what happened, you see riam you were eroneously placed on the shop floor, but in any case you broke our look policy, so you had to be removed”
how could i be erroneously placed on the shop floor, two of my managers read off the work sheet, where i was meant to work, the clear instructions were “mens room 4″
if its the fact that my mini cardigan wasnt from abercrombie that was the problem, why didnt they just give me an abercrombie cardigan from the beginning. i passed my interview fair and square, i only seemed to have problems when I told them about my arm.
any questions?
Thank you for clearing up some of the things that were unclear from the article, Riam. I’m sorry that this happened to you. Good luck with your suit.
I have a question. Did they tell you ‘either remove the cardigan or go in the back’ or was it more like ‘go in the back’? Like, did you have the option of just wearing the polo sans cardigan to comply with dress code? That’s the part I have been confused about.
If you are Riam, I am really sorry for what you are going through. And I really like your name :)
Dear Lisa, I was ordered to go to the stockroom. When I did as I was told, I proceeded to ask the Manager why didnt she ask me to get rid of my cardigan, she replied I always see you wearing it, so I assumed you always wanted to wear it. The cardigan was their idea in the first place when they found out about my hand. When I complained to head management they tried to make it out to be I wasnt meant to be on the shop floor, but in any event, I did not fit the look policy. Yet I know I was meant to be on the shop floor because it was in writing on a clip board and when I went to the stock room, they asked me what job would I like to do, so clearly indicating that there wasnt a job for me but that I needed to be replaced on the shop floor.
Thank you for your question, my mum is happy that you like my name :)
I still can’t get over the fact that you consider Abercrombie luxury.
And who the hell calls A&F “luxury” goods?
Take an economics class people
Simply and incompletely expressed, “luxury goods” are non-necessities.
More completely, luxury goods are those things whose rise in demand, when compared to “necessity goods,” is proportionally larger than the rise in income driving the demand.
Practically, as people have more income they will tend to buy ever more luxury goods and at a rate that rises faster than the rate at which their income rises.
There’s actually a lot more to this than what I’ve outlined here but that is the basic concept and Abercrombie’s inventory and positioning are classic hallmarks of luxury goods.
Nobody who really needs to read that is going to retain it, but thank you Hap for understanding.
i read it and it was quiet insightful thanks hap
What I cannot wrap my head around…. why the FUCK did they hire her if they were so uncomfortable about her arm? I mean, perhaps her store manager hired her and then the visual team was the one with the problem.. but jesus christ. Don’t they have PR people at A&F?? I mean, they are point-blank telling her she has to be in the back room until she can be wearing long sleeves. Holy crap.
I worked retail back in the day and I understand that companies can hire whomever they want to. I honestly don’t really care about that. But to outright tell a person that they cannot be on the floor until they cover up their fake arm? What the fuck?
That’s because they didn’t pay attention and she was likely wearing a long-sleeved top.
but she had special permission to wear a cardigan, so I am guessing that they knew
“I mean, perhaps her store manager hired her and then the visual team was the one with the problem.” that’s exactly what the post says, did you read it?
ah, yes, I did read it. But then it was saying that management was the one who made her go to the stockroom. I don’t understand how anyone made this decision since it is screaming lawsuit. When I worked retail, we had to do all of these seminars about PR things. Maybe the laws are more lax in the UK; I don’t know. And I am surprised the visual team had that much authority. Our visual team was more about the visuals in the store- how the clothes were set up, etc. The only person who I think would have that type of authority would be the store’s district manager (or above the DM), and surely they wouldn’t have been stupid enough to do that.
A&F is somewhat known for hiring a very specific type of person. I actually don’t have much of a problem with that. But making an employee stay in the backroom until they can cover up their fake arm is ridiculous.
They didn’t ask her to cover up her arm though… they asked her to wear a polo. Maybe she could have put a skin colored long sleeve shirt on underneath it? She seems to be the one who doesn’t want it showing.
yeah I know. Like Mark (I believe, below somewhere), when I first read it, it sounded to me like they were making her go in the back. It’s hard to tell if she had the option of wearing a polo and staying on the floor. Like, did she refuse to take off the cardy, and then they were like, well you have to go in the back? I’m just confused. I tried to find more stories about it, but I couldn’t get any clarity.
Until I know more, I now just have a problem with that she was given special permission to wear a cardigan, and that was taken away.
Regardless, retail sucks. I worked at Wet Seal (yeah yeah yeah, I know) YEARS ago as a manager. I had an sales associate that had problem skin. I was actually told by my DM to tell the girl to perhaps try to wear more make-up to try to cover up her blemishes more. I almost died. And no, I did no such thing, and quit shortly after.
Just thinking about that job gives me hives.
If they didn’t want her to work the floor then they shouldn’t have hired her for that position. I get that A&F have this whole shallow yet slutty image going on and that most of their customers are so shallow and coddled by their parents (or more likely their nannies or private school dorm matrons) that they’d freak out at the sight of someone who looks slightly disabled. Whatever, just hire androids. Frankly that girl has the A&F look as far as I’m concerned; at first glance in the photo at least it just looks like she’s wearing some sort of arm band.
Anyway, their image isn’t really the point here. The point is the company hired this woman then tried to push her in to a lower position based on her looks and that is discriminatory. If she were suing them for not hiring her and she believed that was because of her arm but had no evidence I’d be inclined to tell her to suck it up. Since they are openly discriminating based on looks after hiring her I stand behind her decision to sue.
You claim to have such a “high IQ” but you havent mastered the art of reading yet. They didnt have any problem with her arm, she did. They wanted her to wear a short-sleeve like everyone else but she wouldnt. So they pushed her into the back for refusing to wear the uniform, NOT because of her looks. Read the article.
Presumably they hired her knowing that she was going to wear the sweater; if she’d just shown up on the first day and said she wasn’t going to wear the uniform she’d most likely have been told to take a hike considering they routinely send home employees for crimes like wearing the wrong shoes or having the wrong color nail polish.
If she were walking around exposing the prosthetic how long do you think she would have been working there till someone complained and got her fired? Look at all the uproar over the BBC presented with a missing arm. A number of parents have complained about her because they don’t want their precious offspring to realize that there are some people who look a little different. A&F have made it clear on many occasions that their employees must have a very specific look and I very much doubt that includes prosthetic arms.
Thats great that you very much doubt they would have been ok with it and that your confident about what they “would have done” but in lawsuits you cant assume, sorry miss high IQ. They never said anything about her arm and they actually asked her to uncover it in order to comply with the dress code, she didnt want to, and nor did she want to work in the back. It had nothing to do with their thoughts on her body, it had to do with her own thoughts on her body.
This is in response to sjttn because I can figure out how to properly respond to him/her….
One, I’ve worked at A&F and it was a fucking hellhole. They make you buy shitty overpriced jeans and shirts and then they tell you not to help anybody. It’s the most retarded place on the planet.
More importantly, however, the question of whether or not she was asked to wear long sleeves to cover her arms or whether she opted to cover them herself isn’t entirely clear in this article. And this article probably isn’t what they’re using in court. If the case has gotten as far along as this implies, I’m sure they have well-documented facts about what actually happened, instead of an opinion piece published on the internet.
But by all means, continue considering yourself a very intelligent person because you read a bunch of shit on the internet, where anyone can say anything, true or false, without consequence. Go ahead and assume that paid lawyers and paralegals are not adequately making a case for a lawsuit. I wonder why A&F didn’t hire you to represent them, they’d definitely win.
Im sorry Molly but you make no sense, good try though. I never said i had a high IQ i was talking about Rhonda. Second, i ask you to show me where i said anything about lawyers not preparing a good case? I dont think i said anything like that, i said that Rhonda assuming what A & F would or wouldnt do doesnt apply to court. Unless it was something they DID do it doesnt matter. But again, good try.
Nice try Molly but I’ve noticed there’s little point in trying to reason with sjttn.
The issue seems to be that DEAN wanted to wear long-sleeves. Nowhere does it say that the company required her to cover up her arm, nor does it say whether or not she offered to take off the sweater and work in within the summer dress code.
I actually agree. I think they were pretty accommodating. I assume they hired her thinking she would be ok with wearing the polo shirt as everyone else does, but she refused to wear a short sleeved shirt they offered her another position where she could cover herself up more, until the dress code changed to long sleeves.
My cousin is on steroids for a medical condition that results in her gaining a lot of weight. I know its not the same as a disability but it is a medical condition out of her control. If she was uncomfortable wearing a short-sleeved shirt should she also be able to sue if they ask her either wear the dress code or work in another position the back? If so then we need to ban uniforms and dress codes everywhere because people will always be uncomfortable with something.
It doesn’t seem at all that A & F was uncomfortable with her arm, in fact they wanted her to wear a short sleeve that would show it more, so obviously they were concerned with the image of their employees dress, not their bodies. It was Dean herself that was uncomfortable about her arm, she refused to wear a short sleeved shirt but also refused to work in the back. AND isnt it interesting that in that picture she had NO PROBLEM WEARING EXACTLY WHAT THEY WERE ASKING HER TO WEAR? This picture is going to be everywhere, so why doesnt she care now? COME ON.
“Management claimed that she “violated the ‘Look Policy,” which is an imperative part of working for such a prestigious clothing outlet.”
In so claiming, Management have just violated the UK’s Disability Discrimination Act. Section 5 of said Act says
“an employer discriminates against a disabled person if or a reason which relates to the disabled person’s disability, he treats him less favourably than he treats or would treat others to whom that reason does not or would not apply”
Case closed. And they pulled this on a trainee lawyer? This is the reason lawsuits were invented; to financially hurt idiots.
He actually didnt treat her any differently, he said everyone on the floor needs to wear polo shirts. She didnt want to do that so he gave her another job where she could be more covered up.
The DDA also states that when employing a person with a disability the employer must make ‘reasonable adjustments’ to their working practices; in this case allowing her to cover her prosthesis. This was evidently permitted at the commencement of her employment, and only changed following the ‘Visual Team’ inspection. Failure to let her cover her prosthesis is in violation of the Act, and leaves them open to legal action.
So being OK with the prosthesis is bad, having her cover it up is good? That makes a lot of sense.
It’s about what she is most comfortable with. They shouldn’t have hired her in the first place and given her permission to wear a sweater if it was going to be a problem. She was promised a job with certain conditions, and those conditions should not have changed. It’s one thing to give handicapped people the same opportunities as everyone else, but it’s another to pretend they don’t have a handicap. As much as I’m sure she wants to be “treated like everyone else”, you don’t suggest that a wheelchair-confined person take the stairs so as to not make him feel alienated.
I agree with Molly. I will also say that I think she’d probably be able to do her job more effectively with the sweater on. I doubt many people are going to be hesitant to ask her for help because she’s wearing a sweater but there are plenty of people who won’t want to ask her for help because she has a prosthetic arm either because it freaks them out or they just don’t want to work the poor little disabled girl too hard.
I was working in retail while pregnant and almost every day I’d have at least one customer tell me not to worry about something or say they’d go ask someone else because I was pregnant. If I’d been able to hide my pregnancy from customers I would have so it doesn’t surprise me at all that she’d want to cover up her arm. If you look different people treat you differently 90% of the time.
In the US, the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) would be the comparable statute. Offering to allow her to work in the stockroom would qualify as a “reasonable accommodation” under ADA (as long as they didn’t switch her from a full-time to part-time schedule). I don’t know about UK, but an employer is prohibited from asking applicants if they have a disability.
Having read only this post and the story on the Daily Mail site, I would have to side with the employer here.
Hiring someone to work in sales and then moving them to stockroom duties is not a reasonable accommodation, it’s a demotion. Seems to me that it was a sneaky way to get her to quit or create a reason to fire her. Someone with a prosthetic arm is not going to be able to work as effectively in a warehouse as someone of similar age, build, etc. with two natural and fully functioning arms.
You can’t ask if someone is disabled but you can ask if they can fulfill the duties. When hiring someone for a warehouse job it’s standard procedure to ask if they can lift a certain weight or size of box and it’s unlikely that someone with a prosthetic arm will meet those criteria. I’m sure she’s perfectly capable of working the floor but I’m willing to bet that the first time she said she couldn’t lift a box she’d have been fired anyway.
This is all in the hiring forms and would have been sinned by her at the time of employment. Stating that she would have to follow the look policy and it would not be at the employees discretion on what to wear. I understand what one or two people may have said to her but she still had to singh forms. This is a stupid mistake by one or two ignorant managers on wording that their may have been a mistake in stating that she could wear this white top. Would you feel the same way about this if she just wouldn’t of received the job for her disability. Maybe some action with in the company to make the people pay for the trouble and imbaresment that they have caused this young lady. But money, a lawsuit for money, I just see this as greed and try to get ahead by exploiting someone else. Not a fan of most lawsuits, really MONEY makes everyone feel better. The problem is making money more powerful than your word more important in your life than anything els.
Actually after re-reading the title of the article i think the author owes an apology for misrepresenting the story. I would challenge you to find where they told her she had to cover up, where they told her she had to work in the back because of her arm? It was the opposite, they wanted her to take off the cardigan and continue to work in the front. So i think you need to explain how that is them not wanting “anything artificial on their employees”.
and sorry for commenting like 4 times, this is just crazy to me.
and sorry for commenting like 4 times, but I work at a&f.
FTFY
It depends if she was ever given the option, after the “visual team”’s visit, to work the front in short sleeves. Maybe she was, and she said no, and then sent to the storeroom. But maybe they never considered it, just sent her to the storeroom. There’s really no way of knowing without knowing the case in detail, it’ll come out in court tho
And I quote
“One of the members of the team demanded she take off the cardigan, but she insisted she had permission to wear it.”
From the article.
Yes, she HAD PERMISSION to wear it. She wasn’t being noncompliant with the terms she was hired on, and therefore should not be punished.
After it’s all said and done, the visual team needs to revisit the way they look at thingd. The member who insisted on her taking off the cardigan was in the wrong. It sounds like He/she was throwing some weight around and got himself/herself in a law suit.
Actually, the news article is typically incomplete and quite probably got almost all of the facts wrong. Even if you stipulate that the facts as presented are accurate, it is still uncertain whether she had the option of continuing without the cardigan. You have to make an assumption, one way or the other. On first reading, I assumed she was not allowed to work in the front with or without the cardigan. However, after reading comments here and the re-reading the story, I’m no longer certain since the story as written fits either scenario. Typical reporter failure.
I am the same way. That’s how I read it and now I am confused. I think I’ll google her name a lil bit….
She quit. Period.
Regardless of what the employer wanted her to do or what she wanted to do she does not HAVE TO work their. If she doesn’t appreciate the “Look Policies” why is she working for the store to begin with? Thats the point.
there*
This place sounds like it is run by Nazis.
I think she did a very good thing when she quit… that blaring music is ridiculous and annoying.
Regardless of whether she was told or not I find it amazing that in this current economic climate that she would willingly leave a job, my partner has been unemployed since Christmas, maybe I should disable him and he would feel ok to pick and choose his employment.
She’s 22, quite possible she’s living with her parents and maybe still in college so she may not even need the income. Of course she’s also working retail. I know at our local mall half the stores have out signs saying they’re hiring right now (including A&F if memory serves) as do a lot of fast food places around town. There are plenty of jobs out there, just not enough of the kind that pay enough to support a family or even really pay the rent for singletons.
she is still in school- she’s a law student (which makes the whole thing a bit funnier to me)
Yea it’s not really that hard for college kids to find jobs right now.. at least where I live. I may quit mine soon.. it’s not really worth it. I only work so I can have extra money to go out if I want. I love living with my parents.
there are very, very, very few such jobs where I live (Berkeley).
College town! I mean at home on summer vacation. College kids get all the jobs before the high schoolers get out
I’m always reminded of the Emperor’s New Clothes when I see A&F. They somehow sell clothing by modeling nothing at all.
Are these A&F plants here to try to sway public opinion? I bet some are.
I’m appalled at some of these commentators who back up A&F on this issue. Clearly management wanted her to wear the cardigan to cover up her arm, it wasn’t something she requested.
Shall I point you to the Hooters lawsuits where women with small breasts were discriminated against, and won their lawsuits?
It’s 2009. Diversity is wonderful and this kind of discrimination is like white supremacists who don’t you like because you don’t have blonde hair and blue eyes.
Also, I must say that she looks like a beautiful girl from the photo. She could get a gig as a model.
They asked her to take off the Cardigan and wear the polo. As in having the arm showing. She didn’t want to take it off. How is that them asking her to cover it up? They didn’t want her to cover it up.
Well actually let me fill you in, the cardigan was not my idea in the first place, it was their idea. they told me to buy a white cardigan from any store as long as it fits the style of abercrombie. the cardigan was very short and my prosthetic arm was clear to everyone.
in their application form, it did not ask about disability(there was no disabled? then tick here box) so as soon as i got the job, i told them on my induction day.
i dont wear long sleaves in summer, its boiling hot, especially in that store. i was removed from the shop floor and then bullied and taunted by a manager who claimed she didnt know i had permission to wear the cardigan, but the incident happened in front of 4 of my managers and they let it happen.
the head manager wrote me an email and told me “oh yes i heard about what happened, you see riam you were eroneously placed on the shop floor, but in any case you broke our look policy, so you had to be removed”
how could i be erroneously placed on the shop floor, two of my managers read off the work sheet, where i was meant to work, the clear instructions were “mens room 4″
if its the fact that my mini cardigan wasnt from abercrombie that was the problem, why didnt they just give me an abercrombie cardigan from the beginning. i passed my interview fair and square, i only seemed to have problems when I told them about my arm.
any questions?
Assuming you really are the girl in the article and not some random person trying to be funny, should you really be discussing this while you have a pending law suit? It’s not that I’m not interested or don’t want to hear your side, just don’t want you to jeopardize your case by saying something you shouldn’t.
A&F is infamous for removing anyone who doesn’t fit the exact mold. They’ll send someone home for wearing the wrong nail polish or shoes. It really doesn’t surprise me that they’d try to get rid of someone with one arm. It’s wrong but it doesn’t surprise me.
I despise Abercrombie and Fitch and all it’s ilk.
Same with Holister, American Eagle, American Apparel, the gap, etc etc.
Free People all the way.
Kick ass and take names, girl. So many people go unheard about issues like this – take whatever action is necessary.
Me = FORMER A&F customer.
I’ve never set foot in A&F because it’s so damn high priced for stuff you can get much cheaper and for the same quality…and now I never will even think about going into that store just to look, because bunch of sick human beings run that place. I hope she wins the lawsuit.
Thank you cat for your support, i never shopped in that store before i started working there, i only worked there because one of my best friends worked there and told me they were looking for people. but yes it is shockingly expensive.
As much as I think A+F’s treatment of Riam was unwise and ignorant, I certainly do not hope she wins the lawsuit. A private company has the right to hire anyone they choose. If you were selling nail polish, wouldn’t you want your models to have nice nails? Wouldn’t you want the employees who worked at your store to have nice nails? That is not discrimination. It’s marketing.
I have to say that if I were in Riam’s place I would have quit as well and moved on to a better company, but the fact remains that A+F has the right to hire whomever they choose. This may hurt their sales in the future if their actions don’t reflect what the public wants, but the company should not be sued for asking Riam to work in the back.
My third question: Did Riam try to fight it? Did she state that the terms of her continued employment were to be allowed out of the back? Or did she just quit and head straight to court? She had the option to say “Hey look. I don’t like the way I’m being treated and the job that I’m being asked to do because of circumstances beyond my control, so if you don’t change it, I am going to quit.”
Abercrombie & Fitch may be a shallow company that is not accepting of anything outside their desired norm, but that does not warrant a lawsuit.
are you comparing my birth defect to having nice nails??
anyone can improve their nails, I had no say in the way I was born. I feel sorry for anyone who feels the way you do, I am not a monster, I’m a human being, i deserve to be treated like one.
If you are not in a position to know what true discrimination feels like, you couldnt understand what I, or others have been through. I dont want pity, I am simply standing up for myself. I’m glad the law prevents companies from abusing human rights, we as a society have moved on from eugenic practices, my silence would be a signal of approval to allow them to continue to do as they please.
I would like to think society judges people on their abilities, I’m more than able to be a sales assistant, If you feel that people like me should be hidden from view, i suggest you stay at home and never leave your doorstep, because disabled people are everywhere, so get used to it.
Take a tip, stop reading these comments right now and absolutely don’t respond to them, because it’s only going to get more and more frustrating–c’est la Internet.
I am happy you’re standing up for your rights and the rights of others. I know something about the attitudes you’re facing because my father also had one arm. He lost his right arm just above the elbow in an accident and had to learn to do everything with his left (he was right handed) and adapt to life as an ‘one armed bandit’; clearly he didn’t lose his sense of humor along with his arm ;-)
He was somewhat fortunate in that he lost his arm on the job and his company transferred him to a desk job which he kept till he died. I hate to imagine how difficult it must be job hunting with an obvious physical disability. Still, at least your prosthetic arm looks somewhat like your natural arm which I imagine cuts down on random stares on the street. 20+ years ago they were so bad that my dad never even bothered wearing his; it was very heavy, a different color from his skin and of course hairless (he was a very hairy man), and difficult to put on since it had a whole harness that fit over his stump and shoulder.
Hi Riam,
I am in the same condition as you are
Was faced with something similar few years back
would it be possible to talk to you privately?
thanks
Dear Nadal
My name is May, I am Riam’s mother, you can contact Riam via face book, her full name is Riam Katelin Lina Dean, I will pass your message on to her, she is not home today, the court hearing finished yesterday and she is away for the weekend.
Alternately you can ask Sacha for our home telephone number or private email addresses, you are more than welcome to make contact with her.
she has received thousands of messages of support from around the world. More importantly from the children and families of REACH, the Association for children with upper limb disabilities which Riam acts as carer for approximately 70 kids during a week long activity holiday every year.
Its one thing to have a store that sells nail polish wanting their employees to have nice nails. A+F is not selling arms. They are selling clothing that is rediculously cheap to produce and marking it up 600% so that whiny brat children can spend their parents money at the mall so that they learn early in life it is what you have that makes the person, now who are.
To me it is simple: You hire someone knowing they have a disability, and you tell her that covering it up with a piece of clothing, that she undoubtly paid for out of her own pocket, that she will have certain and specific duties. Then she is demoted because the company changed its mind on the policy. To me, A+F should have informed her in a reasonable amount of time of a policy change and given her a choice. “we changed our minds. you may not wear this when you are in this position. if you must wear it, then you must work here”. then she could have made a decision herself.
i had a+f dream last night
it was awful
just though i’d share
Abercrombie are body-fascists of the lowest order, and their treatment of Riam was just slimy. They deserve to be driven out of business for their slimy behavior.
The reality is that Riam was capable of doing the job and their only reason for removing her from the shop floor was the meanest sort of prejudice. For this unjust behavior, they should be dragged into court and made to grovel.
And anyone with a conscience should never buy their clothing.
If they objected to her prosthetic arm, why did they hire her in the first place? They have the right to hire whomever they choose. Consumers are free to shop wherever they choose as well. While their treatment of this girl stinks, lawsuits are not the answer to all of life’s unfairness. Get over it honey and get a job somewhere else. It’ll be A&F’s loss.
I don’t really get whose side the author of this article is in. I think s/he’s being sarcastic about “The embarrassment at her treatment by A&F must be immense.” Yes, the last paragraph is very misleading of her/his point.
My son who luckily doesn’t take after me, is extremely good looking/tall/thin/muscular. He recently walked into A/F to shop and they offered him a job. Since he just moved to his new college town he took it.
The manager was so blatant to tell him that they hire only good looking people and they took a photo of him to send to the home office so they could confirm his good looks before he starts work!
The girl in this story was discriminated against because of a physical defect that did not seem to affect her work ability. The line has to be drawn somewhere. What if A/F decides they only want to market to white people next? Are people born with black skin color going to be off limits?
Honestly, that should be perfectly all right. We ought to let them try to survive as a business after doing that–I doubt they could.
The problem is they have violated federal law. In America we believe that people should not be discriminated against. i.e. race, creed, marital status.
You shouldn’t expect a company to hire a blind photographer. But, in this case her problem is appearance not inability to perform. She did not chose to be armless. If this was a case of tattoos she decided to get that would be different.
We can’t let the free market make these decisions for us. Where would that end up, the crippled persons store and the young healthy person’s store somewhere else?
I’m not a fan of lawsuits either, but in limited cases they are needed. This is an organized corporate attempt to discriminate and the board of directors will not see that it is wrong until it costs them a bunch of money.
Oops, I just read where this was in London. They don’t have a Bill of Rights over there.
Hello,
I think what happened to Riam is absolutely disgusting.
She is a beautiful human being and has a right to work in any retail shop she wishes.
My heart goes out to Riam having to put up with A&F discriminating against her.
She is obviously a very bright individual.
Having a prospethic arm should not be the reason to make someone work in the stock room or warehouse.
I wish you all the best with your law suit and wish you all the best for the future.
Riam you are a perfectly attractive girl and your arm doesn’t bother me a bit. A&F is disgusting and I will NEVER shop in their stores, it’s overpriced crapola anyway.
Riam you are HOT! I would totally ask you out.
after it’s all said and done, the visual team needs to take a closer look on how they look at their employees. did this visual team member go directly to Dean? did they discuss her situation with management and then proceed with caution, care, and consideration. Or was this some hothead who feels important and made a bad call by handling the situation wrong. If anything A&F needs to take a closer look at their visual team.
A&F is such a ripoff. They sell clothes that are so tattered that even the thrift shop wouldn’t take them to spoiled brats for insane amounts of money. It never ceases to amaze me when I see a mother exiting one of their stores with her teen daughter wearing a ripped up, worn out denim mini that barely covers her privates. You’re raising a real winner there, mom! I just keep thinking of the fable about the Emperor’s new clothes.
What they did to her was assinine, but who wants to be one of their clones pushing crap anyway? This young lady has a lot of spunk and character. She’s better off working for a company with a good reputation who’ll appreciate her for what she has to offer.
The way our local news media portrayed this was as though the girl was demoted for having a handicap.
Help me out here and tell me where I misunderstand;
1.They hired her and gave her a special exemption from wearing the REQUIRED uniform.
2.SHE did not wish to work up front wearing the same uniform as all of the other employees.
3.They were still willing to make an exception for her by saying “Fine, if you don’t feel comfortable wearing the same uniform as the rest of the sales staff we’ll let you work elsewhere in the store until we get outfits in that YOU will be comfortable with”.
4. SHE quit.
And the idea that she feels the people who do the hard work…the stock room staff….are “underlings” who she was too good to work with?
So if someone hired you as a shift supervisor say and then told you that you were only going to be working register or folding or whatever you wouldn’t consider that a demotion? It’s a whole different job and yes, the stock room job is easier. As a former retail worker I’m sure you know that working with customers is hard work that requires brains and personality and other skills. Working the stock room is easy because your personality and appearance are largely irrelevant. Sure it’s physically harder (bit of a problem for someone with a physical disability don’t you think?) but I know I loved working in the stock room for an hour or two because it was so much easier than working the floor. I would not have wanted to work it full time however because it gets boring fast so if I were hired for sales and then demoted to full time stock work I’d quit too.
As you stated in your first point, Riam was given special permission to wear a cardigan over the required uniform. That is a reasonable accommodation and part of the terms under which she was hired. A&F then changed those terms by telling her to either take it off or get demoted after only a few days working there.
“Riam was given special permission to wear a cardigan over the required uniform…part of the terms under which she was hired. A&F then changed those terms ”
You are absolutely correct on that point.
As far as the idea of stock work being a demotion I’d have to say it depends on the company.
I worked for years for Robinson’s May and as a stock person I worked every bit as hard as when I was later promoted to management and I might add that I made almsot double what the sales staff did.
Then again, as in your own experience, it surely varies from one situation to another.
I thought about this story for a while and I believe I know what’s behind it and I bet you’ve experienced something similar having worked inretail;
I think what happened was the big wigs were visiting and the store manager (or one of the other members of management) were afraid of getting yelled at for having an employee “out of uniform”.
Since the story says that the visiting visual team member made an issue of it I’ll bet that someone at the store got in hot water and moving her to the stock room was their solution (not necessarily the best one perhaps).
Face it; If a major store, or any other business, has a policy such as a dress code nobody at the store level should make exceptions without getting permission from the bigger mucky-mucks.
I bet this whole situation was created by a low level manager making an exception that they did not have the authority to make and then trying to cover their own butt.
Well if the management has to call the bigwigs every time they want to make a decision as minor as allowing an employee to make a small change to the uniform then that would certainly explain why A&F are so expensive.
When I worked retail our dress policy was uniform t-shirts for the part timers and uniform button down shirts for the full timers with jeans or khakis and that was pretty strictly enforced. We could wear plain long sleeve shirts underneath the short sleeve t-shirts to protect our arms but that was it. I was working there while pregnant and the assistant manager gave me permission to wear one of the button down shirts because t-shirts were really not flattering on pregnant women. One day a head honcho came in (regional manager, one of 5 across the whole US) and asked about my shirt. I just told him that the t-shirts didn’t fit properly and that the button down looked better and that was that.
Managers need the autonomy to make little decisions like that otherwise the whole chain gets bogged down.
HAHA! WOW! Your special. Its easier huh???? You really must be some kind of expert that has never held either position with this company so you would have no clue. I really wonder how you and about every other person on this page really think that they are high and mighty. They know fashion they know what’s right and wrong they know who are bad parents bc of where they shop all you people suck a little bit. Most of you know nothing about anything and just sit on that perch and judge. Your not the Lord.
During the interview the group of kids is told what they can and cannot do. They are told about look policy and the other procedures and expectations of the company. So when they leave that interview they know what exactly is expected of them. If the manager decides to hire, they have already been told about these polices before they accept the job. On their first day they sign a forms saying they comply with the look policy. Therefore she should have known that they do not make exceptions for anyone of their associates, and anyone that has ever work in HR knows you do not make exceptions. So (assuming) she signed the forms, she agreed to the look policy and still am wondering what the problem is? I understand she has a disability but the cardigan would still be an exception to the look policy and should not be worn. And Rhonda if you were to come in to work with nail polish and the wrong shoes you should get sent home as well bc obviously you can’t listen to a simple instruction on look policy!!!!!!!!!!!!
ALSO;
Doesn’t this sort of thing send the signal to employers that if you hire a handicapped person you are just opening yourself up to a lawsuit the first time the person doesn’t get their way?
LET ME ADD;
1.As a former retail manager I would not hesitate to hire the girl (given her application and interview were in order) nor would I expect her to wear anything she felt uncomfortable with provided what she did wear was in good taste and
2. I would never spend a dime at Abercrombie and Fitch before this or after.
Banana Republic hires anyone. My store has a tranny and a woman with an eye patch. It doesn’t change the fact that I like their clothes. A&F is pretentious nonsense. What do they really sell that you couldn’t get elsewhere cheaper? Not to mention I nearly go deaf any time I walk in there thanks to the blasting music.
The term “tranny” is offensive. Just fyi!
HELL YES ITS OFFENSIVE. You probably didn’t realize that, but just to let you know.
It’s one of those words that you shouldn’t use unless it fits you (like being Afr-Amer and using the n word) or are very close to that group and they tell you its ok.
By “fits you” I of course meant if you are in that category (being transgender, being African American, being gay, being disabled…)
I AM ASSUMING YOU WERE BORN WITH YOUR ARM MISSING BELOW THE ELBOW. I, TOO WAS BORN THIS WAY MANY YRS AGO. I, TOO FACED DISCRIMINATION,I BELIEVE THAT TODAY IS A BETTER ENVIRONMENT FOR PEOPLE THAT LOOK DIFFERENT, THOSE YOU DEALT WITH ARE VERY IGNORANT AND HAVE A FLAWED OUTLOOK ON THE REAL WORLD. I HAVE ACCOMPLISHED MANY CAREERS,TEACHER,DEVELOPER OF GOLF COURSES, EXECUTIVE DR. OF A NATIONALLY TELEVISED,PGA TOUR EVENT FOR 15 YRS AND I AM ALSO AN EXCELLENT ONE ARMED GOLFER. NICKNAMED THE “ONE ARMED BANDIT” I WOULD BE DELIGHTED TO CORRESPOND WITH YOU AND SHARE STORIES.ADVERSITY
MAKES ONE STRONG AND DETERMINED WITH THAT IN MIND YOU CAN BE WHATEVER YOU CHOOSE IN LIFE
THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS GO WITH YOU
I have not read all of the comments written about this article but as a former manager for Abercrombie and Fitch I wanted to clear up one thing. It is their policy by HR that if for any reason, the associates choice or management choice, the associate must be asked to change positions. If the associate does not want to change then that is their right because the associate interviewed and passed the interview to work on the sales floor. The interview guides are very structured in the questions that are asked as well as the ranking system. Good luck with your suit!
Thank you Mary, I will pass your details to Riam, she will be delighted to read your message. Riam too plays table tennis, tennis and badminton, an excellent swimmer, and is famous for her saying, NEVER SAY I CANT UNTIL YOU ATTEMPT TO.
In answer to my thoughts exactly, Riam was replaced, thats all I can say for now, we have to wait for the verdict, before we can say any more.
It is my personal opinion that A&F is wasting their time even worrying about the staff’s appearance to this degree. When I shop for clothing I’m looking at the product and price. I honestly couldn’t tell you what the last ten sales people I’ve dealt with look like. Even if they are especially helpful, I just don’t care enough to remember. Now, if they are rude-THAT I remember.
On another note, I bought an A&F pullover sweater at a garage sale for a quarter. It seems to be worth it. The tag reads, “Made in Bangladesh.” What if they used salespeople from the factory? Or sold their clothing exclusively online? Then they wouldn’t have to see their ugly customers….
Good luck Riam.
well !
Did A&F managers ask her to buy a cardigan because it would make her fit in or did she hear this in the speech when they say you can buy non branded clothes of your own as long as it conforms to the “look policy”.It seems to me really harsh if she was picked on but feel that as a law studant maybe she is using A&F to make a name for herself and maybe help with the studant loan.
Good luck Riam, I applaud you for standing up for what should be a “no brainer” in the way human beings treat one another.
I guess I am either especially addled or at least half blind because when I first saw your photo accompanying this article my only thought was “wow, what a lovely young lady.” It was only after getting a few sentences in the article that I looked back and said “oh, didn’t even notice about her arm until they pointed it out.”
One day humans will evolve. We just haven’t made it there yet.
Abercrombie & Fitch employees are not required to wear a polo shirt or jeans. I work there and was working there at the time of this incident. Jeans are required to some extent– most of the time, but currently certain dresses the store sells are permitted. In addition, all shirts, etc., must be gray, navy or white. HOWEVER, employees are not required to wear Abercrombie. They can wear whatever they want provided it is the 3 colors listed above and does not have a visible competitors logo. This is not hard to accomplish. I have worn shirts from American Apparel and cardigans from J.Crew while on the job. Every retail store has a dress code. Not saying it’s appropriate it to punish a person for having a prosthetic limb. But I have been wearing long sleeves practically the entire time I have worked there. So do lots of other people I work with. Furthermore, the stock room is not for “underlings”. Yes the job titles are “model” and “impact team” but don’t get caught up with the nouns people. Everyone does the same thing, with the exception that impact people know a lot more about the stock room. I am a model and I work in the front folding clothes. I’m not idolized for it. It’s an unglamourless $8 an hour part time job. Just saying I think people make too big a deal out of Abercrombie and their “look policy”. It’s really not that ridiculous if you can follow a few normal dress code policies that any retail store would have.